Schätzel: Steiner, Drones & Science Fiction

Back in early 2023, I visited several wineries in the Rheinhessen, with a group of wine friends. We went to quite a good mix of addresses – classic names as well as very natural-leaning wineries – and Kai Schätzel was among them. The visit made me thrilled: by how Kai thought about things, by what I saw, and by what I was able to taste. For me, his winemaking wasn't either of the polar opposites: neither ultra-natural in the dogmatic sense, nor rigidly classical.

Which he could easily be, given that he’s at the helm of a 600-year-old estate that owns some of the most lauded Grosse Lage terroirs of the whole area. Instead, Kai and his partner Jule Eichblatt look at things from the future perspective: How would we behave now if we were looking back from the year 3000? (A symbolic number you’ll find also on their bottles and initiatives, like the Kommune 3000 regenerative farming education program.)

That's how I understood the concept that Kai and Jule use: 'modern wine.' I like it; it's true in the best sense of the term. Modernism today doesn’t mean controlled fermentation, stainless steel, artificially constructed expressive aromatics, as was the case of the late 20th-century winemaking. Modern wine for the modern consumer in 2025, if you can put it that way, is sustainable, truthful, alive. It's a combination of good terroir, nature, and people. Or "a dialogue between traditional knowledge, current craft, and future tools", as Jule and Kai put it in our interview below.

Modern wine can do without unnecessary references to ancient methods, without defining itself in opposition to others, and without extremism. It can coexist across the entire spectrum. It's neither right nor left. This vision appeals to me and I agree with it, so I was naturally very interested in an interview with this outside-of-the-box, future-thinking couple.

Words by Milan Nestarec & Lucie Kohoutová, photos courtesy of Schätzel / Yulia Morozova-Beck

First of all, I have to say that you two are really inspiring to me. I always keep one eye on your work and identify with many of your perspectives. Thank you for that. I’d like to start simply and lightly: How are you? I understand that you are busy, as the vines are currently flowering, but I mean it in a more general way. What period of your lives are you experiencing right now? Is it even possible to tell, without some distance?

Jule: The question can be seen from two perspectives... At this moment, I feel positively excited and a bit stressed as we’re hosting three major events next week. Guests from across the world are coming to Nierstein—it’ll be a fantastic weekend, but there’s a lot to prepare and coordinate. As both a perfectionist and improviser, this will be a wild week [laughs]. Looking at the bigger picture, the past few years have brought lots of highs and lows—growth, reflection, and big changes. I compare it to my bike training: after three years, I outgrew my first racing bike. I realized I needed better equipment to move to the next level. In July, my new racing bike and our first office assistant will arrive.

Kai: I’ll jump right in with Jule’s bike picture. Four years ago, I got back into downhill mountain biking. I never expected what it would lead to. Today, I’m taking jumps and clearing gaps I once thought were beyond reach. It’s very comparable to our wine style: when we started producing our first naturally stable wines in 2017, we never imagined this would become our new standard for all dry wines. Today, we bottle Grand Cru [Grosse Lage] wines without filtration. That's the next level.

I’d like to learn more about you two and your background. Jule, you come from the northern part of Germany and started a successful organic food delivery service—is that true? Can you tell me more about your journey?

Jule: Yes, that’s right. I grew up on a crop farm in Northern Germany, near Hamburg and Lübeck. Agriculture and nature have always been part of my life. After studying management, I co-founded my first startup with my friend Eva. We bootstrapped, won scholarships, and eventually raised millions from investors. Frischepost was an online shop and delivery service for organic food—brought by electric vans and reusable boxes from local farms to homes, kindergartens, and offices. We launched in Hamburg in 2015 and expanded to Berlin, Munich, Cologne, and Mainz.

During the first COVID year, we scaled rapidly, but the pace led to burnout. I took a break and joined the harvest team at Schätzel—where I met Kai. In 2022, I left the startup and completed a two-year training as a systemic coach and family therapist. Today, I coach entrepreneurs and co-lead the Schätzel brand and business alongside Kai—and I truly love this combination.

Kai, you took over the winery at a relatively young age, right? I imagine that came with some defiance and provocation—at least speaking from my own experience. How do you remember that time?

Kai: Compared to our interns today, I wasn’t that young—I was 29 when I took over in 2008. But I was full of fire.

So I started experimenting. I questioned the status quo and dove into the future of farming and fermentation. The wines from that time were wild—reductive, often bitter and acidic, sometimes funky. Some sommeliers loved them, but they were tough to sell—especially in the age of Pinot Gris.

We agreed to talk about the future—but before that, I want to ask about you two. You’re a couple, and it seems that you work really well together. I imagine you inspire each other. Can each of you tell me what makes your partner exceptional?

Kai: Jule is powerful and reflective. Deep and clear. She’s full of optimism and courage—always standing up for her values and for the future. Together, we are a syntropic system. Partners in freedom. Freedom first.

Jule: Kai is my source of creativity. He’s a truly free thinker—and I’m constantly impressed by that. He shares my two most important values: freedom and equality. He doesn’t limit himself and he meets me with total trust. If you’ve ever experienced that, you know how beautiful it is.

At last, the future. I’m glad I’ve found kindred spirits who like to talk—and think—about it. Sometimes I feel I think about it too much. Is the future a fundamental topic for you, something that guides your actions? Can you even say what the future of vine growing and winemaking is?

Both: Absolutely. For us, the future isn’t abstract. It’s a filter through which we shape the present.

Our strategy is inspired by a science-fiction perspective, thinking from the future back to now.

I really love your term “modern wines” and the way you interpret it as a bridge between natural wine and exceptional terroir. Can you tell me more?

Both: “Modern” means state-of-the-art. It’s the most advanced way to create wine stability—without additives, without filtration, and without compromise. This isn’t a passing trend, it’s a paradigm shift. Modern wines carry more content. They speak of terroir, aging, flor yeast - and they’re alive. Often with lower alcohol, always with a message.

I feel similarly about “modern farming.” It’s not just a romantic return to the roots. I understand it as a synthesis of different schools of thought. I think it’s a great term—very complete. Are you developing your own syntropic system?

Both: Yes. Modern farming is like a dialogue between traditional knowledge, current craft, and future tools. We’ve never fully identified with a single school. Rudolf Steiner inspires us—but so do drones and science fiction. For us, a smart vineyard is one where sheep and technology coexist. And the outcome doesn’t even have to be alcoholic. We’re open to new worlds: fermented, non-alcoholic, experimental.

People often struggle with change. Do you think the conversation about the future and new ideas has always existed—or is it something new, accelerated by our times?

Both: Adaptation and innovation have always been part of successful stories. The history of farming is a thriller, full of calm chapters and radical twists. But sometimes, pioneers become defenders of the past. If they hold power, they can block the next stage of evolution. That’s dangerous. We try to stay beginners, entrepreneurs. That’s where growth starts.

What do you think will be the biggest challenge for growers? Will it be having enough shade in the vineyards? I’m thinking of your trellises and self-supporting pergolas. I have to say I was really inspired and I’ll try it this year. I can imagine the benefits—but what are the pitfalls? What should I avoid?

Both: Yes, shade is becoming essential. Our Grand Cru sites used to thrive in full sun. Now, they’re the first to suffer from climate stress. More sun, more wind—it’s like a blow dryer on the vines. Without intervention, they’ll dry out in a few years. So we create shade: pergolas, trees, and maybe even solar panels one day, to harvest energy while cooling the system.

To name some pitfalls: don’t release chickens before the canopy is dense—hawks are fast and efficient. Rethink spraying: by hand from below, by drone from above. Stay optimistic—even when neighbors are confused. In the end, it’s only wine [laugh].

You planted 250 trees in your vineyards all at once—that’s quite the move. I so admire doing what you deeply believe in. Can you tell me more about how you planned it? Was it mostly instinct, or did it follow a more detailed system? I think this could be a great source of inspiration for others.

Both: We started with a pioneer mix of nine species: poplar, willow, chequer tree, black walnut, wild cherry, birch, and others planted in a diverse, layered system. Syntropic agriculture works in 3D and across time. Each tree teaches us something. Sure, they compete with vines at first, but in the long run, they create a living system that pumps water, stores carbon, and rebuilds soil health. Our plan was part instinct, part experience—and part curiosity about what’s to come.

It’s not just about regenerative agriculture with you—it’s also about social sustainability. Kommune 3000 is something I deeply admire. Whose idea was it—more Jule’s or Kai’s? How does it actually work, and what’s surprised you the most? Do you find inspiration in other people and stories?

Both: Kommune 3000 belongs to both of us. It’s a space to grow, to create, and to share—much more flexible than a traditional winery. We’ve brewed grape beer and made pink Petnat. We host founders’ retreats and vineyard festivals. We rent two apartments for guests and run team events with our crew.

The team has a share in the turnover, so there’s real commitment. What inspires us most? People. We’ve never stopped believing in them. For us, HR is the terroir of the future.

That’s why Schätzel today is not just a winery—it’s a living commune. And “3000” is our science fiction mindset.

How do you think about your carbon footprint? I appreciate your use of light glass bottles, recycled corks, minimalist packaging. What’s next? What challenges lie ahead? Personally, I’m not into buzzwords like photovoltaics or electric cars.

Both: For us, farming is the most powerful tool we have against climate change. Plants are the best carbon sink and they restore life to the soil. Yes, we use lightweight bottles, minimal packaging, recycled corks - but the real shift happens underground. In the root zone. In the living ecosystem. That’s where the real work begins.

I love technology, and when I visited your winery, I got the sense that you do too. I’ve spent a lot on it—only to realize sometimes the simplest things are best. How do you see the role of technology in “modern farming”? Are we talking drones, AI… or something else?

Both: Modern farming is about merging natural processes with minimal-invasive tech-like drones or AI. We believe in tools that are precise, efficient, and gentle. Tractors, for example, are not minimal-invasive. But an AI system that thinks 24/7, optimizes spraying, and monitors growth? That’s sustainable – and affordable in the long run.

Now for a different topic that I could talk about for hours: Flor. I think you have the most experience with it in Central Europe. Kai, I remember you once said that aging under flor is a universe in itself—just as important as fermentation. So… how did it all start? And what have you learned?

Kai: Flor was an accident when it appeared for the first time in 2017. Now it’s a strategy. We monitor each barrel and photograph the flor on the surface—each one is like a fingerprint. We’ve learned to interact with it: sometimes we remove wine to give it air, sometimes we top up to compress it or feed it with fresh glycerin from young wines. And sometimes we just wait. Nature has its own rhythm. We’re still learning. Still speechless.

You also use the solera system. I assume it’s not a direct copy of Jerez in your case—how do you approach it? Do you feel terroir expresses itself even more clearly through multiple vintages?

Both: Solera is our method to combine vintages. There is a Solera mother barrel with a blend of 8 vintages today. Once a year, we bottle 50 % of it. The barrel is then topped-up with other pre-aged barrels and so on. Aging wines for more than 8 years in untouched barrels adds a whole new dimension and terroir is very present in aged wines. The solera method gives us freedom to follow nature’s rhythm, and to let the wine find its balance over time.

You’re part of the VDP [Verband Deutscher Prädikatsweingüter, a German organisation that promotes the country's top wines and estates]—a prestigious organisation. Is the system rigid, or have you managed to bring fresh energy into it? Do you care about changing things from the inside?

Both: VDP stands for prestige and tradition, but we also see it as a platform for change and innovation. We bring fresh ideas, gently, but persistently. “Modern agriculture” isn’t mainstream there yet, but the door is open. And we believe change is more powerful from the inside than the outside. The VDP is the best club of wine producers in Germany, and we’re honored to be part of it.

I love your statement that you don’t want to make elite wines—even though you could, given vineyards like Pettenthal, Rothenberg, Hipping. You see Modern Wines as wines for everyday use—a kind of “socialist” approach. How has the wine consumer changed—and how will they change in the future?

Both: Taste is like fashion, it evolves. And it improves. We believe that once people experience more good wine made without additives, they’ll embrace it. Alcohol isn’t the reason to drink wine. Conscious consumption is growing - and the younger generation gives us hope.

And finally—my classic closer: Is wine an art form for you? Or is it a consumer product? All answers are valid.

Both: Copying old paintings isn’t art, inventing a new style of painting can be.

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